Everton Vs Tottenham: Match Thread

[Ace]

I'll take a draw at goodison any day of the week to be honest. Even though Janssens chance might be bugging me a bit.

The problem for me is the bench. We have absolutely nothing to do to change the game. Zero impact players apart from Janssen. Need to adress that asap. Or get chadli and clinton back on the bench(And son after the olympics) or bring someone in

 

[C0YS]

Nothing wrong with Wanyama today.

Shit shape and shit from established stars.

Bringin up Eriksens stats is laughable.

If you only pass backwards, and never attempt a tackle, your stats will be great.

Every year we fail to prepare for the season. Players in the team with an hour of football to their names.

Fucking Australia....

His tackling stats were the best in the squad.

I am not saying he had a good game, he clearly didn't, but to say he never attempted a tackle is actually completely false. He attempted more tackles than any other player, on level terms with Toby, and he won the equal highest amount of tackles level with Walker.

I am not saying Wanyama had a worse game, he didn't. I don't think he played well, but that is beside the point. I used that statistic for comparison. Not because I was trying to prove Eriksen had a good game, but rather I was demonstrating that the assumptions made in the post I replied to where statistically incorrect. They were an exaggeration, and also peddled the myth that he didn't/doesn't tackle.

 

[nattydredd]

Good draw against a decent side. No complaints here. It could've been worse..but it weren't.

1st day of the season. Rustiness will be there...we'll be good this season. I'm confident.

Onto the next one...

 

[C0YS]

You continue to watch stats and we will watch football. Eriksen was crap no matter which way you want to spin it

I think everyone has missed my point.

I never said eriksen wasn't crap. Eriksen was crap. I was pointing out eriksen did tackle, and his passing stats where quite good, based on a particular post that was making (intentionally) exaggerated statistical observation.

I do not see statistics as a very good way to understand football games, but I do think they are useful. And so does Poch and pretty much every manager managing in the top division.

I also believe confirmation bias does exist, and if we want to understand whats going on in a game, we have challenge our biases.

 

[Sevens]

Cannot see us beating them? Don't be so fucking dramatic.

Being fucking dramatic would be me stating they would hammer us. Citing that I can't see us beating Everton at their place is far from dramatic. As is often the case with fans (of all clubs) they over rate their own club and under rate the opposition.

Everton at Goodison Park was never going to be a stroll to victory so for you to claim that us not beating them is being fucking dramatic, makes you fucking deluded.

 

[Maske2g]

I'll take a draw at goodison any day of the week to be honest.

Didn't realise it was 1986....

They are gash, and they had a substitute, 5ft 7, right winger give us the run around up front.

 

[Sevens]

Yep, imagine playing that retentionless Wanyama, huh?

I can only assume you aren't that familiar with Wanyama's strengths and weaknesses.

 

[Sevens]

Didn't realise it was 1986....

They are gash, and they had a substitute, 5ft 7, right winger give us the run around up front.

The arrogance of some of our fans never ceases to astound me. In the Premier League there are literally no easy away days. A draw away against any club that is in contention for a top 10 finish by the season end, is a decent result.

 

[Gaz_Gammon]

Poch is very demanding of the players to grow and develop.

I think this season poch will also need to grow as manager and add a couple more strings to his bow.

I think the only thing that needs to grow is Eriksen's balls.

Love the guy but when a game truly hots up he has a tendancy to go m.i.a.

 

[Ace]

Didn't realise it was 1986....

They are gash, and they had a substitute, 5ft 7, right winger give us the run around up front.

Yeah cause the height of a player determines how good he is

 

[Vincent30]

His tackling stats were the best in the squad.

I am not saying he had a good game, he clearly didn't, but to say he never attempted a tackle is actually completely false. He attempted more tackles than any other player, on level terms with Toby, and he won the equal highest amount of tackles level with Walker.

I am not saying Wanyama had a worse game, he didn't. I don't think he played well, but that is beside the point. I used that statistic for comparison. Not because I was trying to prove Eriksen had a good game, but rather I was demonstrating that the assumptions made in the post I replied to where statistically incorrect. They were an exaggeration, and also peddled the myth that he didn't/doesn't tackle.

But you don't see the other arguement, why did he make 3 tackles, were these on occassions when he had a poor touch or a misplace pass and had to win it back etc, or was it in a weak one on one in the corner of the pitch that meant nothing, i could give thousands of examples.

From watching the actual game and not going back through all this stats rubbish, did any of these 3 tackles result in us pressing the oppostion and getting a goal or a clear cut chance? No!!! So what use is it for our AM to make 3 tackles when they are achieving very little. He is there to press the oppostion into mistakes, to create goals and to score them. Today he failed spectacularly in all three areas.

In the final third today he was awful, slow in making decisions, losing the ball in key attacks and genrally zero threat. You do understand that stats don't paint the whole picture right? Didn't Leon Britton at Swansea go through a period of having better pass completion than the likes of Xavi and Iniesta.... come on, the game is so much more than that.

 

[greaves]

Desiderata:
No easy games.
Repeat truism four thousand times and eat cabbage and potato sog.
Don't be too pessimistic, things will get better.
Don't be too optimistic either (or arrogant) when we hammer someone and then assume that everything will be perfect forever and ever amen.
One swallow doesn't make a Lewinsky.

 

[parj]

He was sub par, yes.

But for me the biggest problem isn't the individual performances of the front four. It was our failure to make space in attacking areas.

I think the failure of this, was partly down to a 5 at the back system which seeks to pin our fullbacks down (which worked so well for West Ham) and partly to do with the failure for our central midfielders to bring the ball forward (I think Toby saw this problem, same with Verts and they tried to move up the pitch a lot more than normal).

Basically in a very defensive set up, the attacking four can move all they like on the final third on the pitch and they will find limited space, this is because defensive players outnumber offensive players and a particularly well drilled team has markers based on position. Wherever a player may moved they will be marked and find little space. Our play relies heavily on overloads of central areas, so a lot of players in a small amount of space who attempt to play thought teams often using high risk maneuvers. For this to be successful players need a bit, not a lot, but a few meters of space. To create this space we normally push our full backs up and in doing stretch the play. The problem is that Everton like West Ham before played a system which essentially served to prevent the fullbacks going forward, and if they do expose them to best possible effect. The other way we create space is by having a player move from deep, this forces defending players to come and block the run and in doing so it frees space for someone else.

I believe we need both these options, and I feel there is a pattern emerging, used by west ham, to counter our fullbacks threat In these games we really need a type who can move defenses from deep, an extra man from deep who can either beat players (like dembele) or who is mobile and moves into spaces opened up by simply when closed down pass the ball, and then move into the space that was opened up by the pressure moving out of position (like Modric is good at).

What I am trying to say is too many people concentrate on individual performances out of context. The problem today was a team problem, and actually a tactical one. This was the major problem. Not just individual performances.

Totally agree with back 5 being the problem. If our full backs are not pushing up then we are essentially starving our attacking of options.

I also think Erikson and Alli cannot play in the starting line up because their best work comes from being in the centre. Either being wide is a waste 5of their talent

 

[Chinaspur]

I was at Goodison sitting with the bluenoses bang in line with halfway line. Massive gulf between two defensive mids and front four was why we didn't win this game.

 

[Lamelad]

Good result considering how we usually start seasons and after being 1 down while Goodison is a difficult place to go.

One might argue that winning the game would have been an improvement on last season and that teams going for the title should win games like this.

It also has to be noted that we played them today without Coleman, and Lukaku, arguably two of their best players.

 

[StartingPrice]

We should of won? Come on Everton away is a tough game, especially with a new manager and players trying to impress. Every point in this league will count, i wouldn't be surprised at all if the team that wins the league this year has the lowest points total in the premier league.

Frustrating we couldn't nick it in the second half and have to once again take positives that we have that fighting spirit to come back into a game.

And as others have commented, i feel Lamela should be our middle man behind the stiker. Cleary most in form and i think he could be devastating in that postion.

Doesn't the team that has the lowest points total in the Premier League, like...er...usually finish bottom and get relegated?

 

[Typical Spurs]

Understand people being disappointed with Alli's performance. But please don't forget how poor he was in quite a few games last season. But he has the ability to change a game with a bit of magic. Palace away last season he was total gash, then scores a worldie. Villa away he was tripe, then gets an assist for Kane. He's just that type of player. Eriksen will never appear to be a blood and guts player, but has absolute quality IMO. To a lot of fans though including me, those who you can see making an effort, like Lamela, goes down far better than not looking too bothered about tackling etc. All players are different I guess. how good was Glenda, but he was not a big tackler or physical. Yet he's probably the best we've had.

Was really happy with Jansen. It's nice to have another plan when trying to brake a team down. I don't think he'll be sub much longer.

 

[Vincent30]

Doesn't the team that has the lowest points total in the Premier League, like...er...usually finish bottom and get relegated?

Well played!! Haha

 

[danielneeds]

It is a biggie. If he is going to stroll then put on someone who is going to run. Worse Spurs player on the pitch today in my opinion

But he always runs, infact he ran more than any other player last season. He wasn't good today, but it wasn't for lack of trying. There was just zero space for him to exploit in the first half. The people who call him lazy, remind me of the sorts of people who said the same about Hoddle when he played for England. In short, morons.

 

[Tucker]

Can't help but feel that if we hadn't gone to the other side of the world for preseason we likely wouldn't have been so rusty.