Ratings v West Ham

[Lanh]

I can't believe anybody would blame Bale for the goal by saying he wasn't on the post, do you seriously think that the players don't have instructions on where they should be facing corners?

Ah, so you're saying that 'Arry had an aberration and either forgot to remind Bale to watch the post at corners as he clearly does with Benni or that he simply decided today only to cover one post?

 

[Legend10]

Ah, so you're saying that 'Arry had an aberration and either forgot to remind Bale to watch the post at corners as he clearly does with Benni or that he simply decided today only to cover one post?

He clearly decided to cover 1 post as we usually do anyway and continued to do so in the 2nd half.

Bale doesn't decide where to go or who to mark at corners, set pieces are a key component of the game and all players will have specific instructions.

 

[Legend10]

The failure to buy a strong, athletic and pacy striker, compounded with Defoe's injury has left us with a front line more toothless than Everton. We're left with three donkeys, one very tall and awkward one, one very slow with flappy arms and one who doesn't want to be here.

This will be a massive short coming this year.

We do have real problems up front, Defoe's injury has compounded it to the point of having a major weakness in our team.

 

[Lanh]

He clearly decided to cover 1 post as we usually do anyway and continued to do so in the 2nd half.

Really?

So I'm imagining a white shirt on both posts after they scored and in our other games am I? Fucking hallucinations, I thought they'd stopped. :bang:

 

[Legend10]

Really?

So I'm imagining a white shirt on both posts after they scored and in our other games am I? Fucking hallucinations, I thought they'd stopped. :bang:

We marked both posts on one following corner yesterday not on all, and in the main we don't usually mark both.

 

[sloth]

Just a brief question to the Bale shoulds not have payed LB people. Who else did we have to put there today?

Didn't see the game.

But, specifically on your question, I think you'll find quite a few of us were questioning the playing of BAE against Arsenal the other night. For some reason Harry thought he'd better rest Hutton who'd played half a competitive game all season, but not BAE who had played virtually every game.

Bassong played LB at Newcastle apparently and describes himself as a CB or LB, i would have thought he'd have a try out against Arsenal at LB. Then we'd have been able to play our favoured BAE Bale leftside against WHam.

 

[BringBack_leGin]

Generally it's up to the goalie if anyone goes on the post, and whom. So said Di Matteo on Goals on Sunday this morning anyway.

 

[spurs_viola]

Didn't see the game.

But, specifically on your question, I think you'll find quite a few of us were questioning the playing of BAE against Arsenal the other night. For some reason Harry thought he'd better rest Hutton who'd played half a competitive game all season, but not BAE who had played virtually every game.

Bassong played LB at Newcastle apparently and describes himself as a CB or LB, i would have thought he'd have a try out against Arsenal at LB. Then we'd have been able to play our favoured BAE Bale leftside against WHam.

Very sensible - but we are not allowed to question Harry's decisions here because he "brought us the 4th place last season", are we?

With the team Harry put out v Arsenal, it would not have mattered much if Bassong was at LB rather than at CB, with Huddlestone at CB for that game (where he would not have had to run as much as in midfield and could have been taken off in 2nd half if required) and Hutton at RB. That would have saved BAE for the league game, given Bassong and Hutton more playing time and perhaps kept Huddlestone a bit sharper than he looked after the week's rest.

 

[kkemal]

:clap::clap::clap::clap::clap:

thank fuck someone with a bit of football sense.....agree with every comment you made fella!!

I can't beleive how some can't fucking see that luka was playing at another level to everyone else on the pitch....he is a little gem, and i felt so sorry for him.

those who wrote he offered little...:duh: ......
i will note and stay well clear of in the future...very scary lack of football knowledge...

tommy..slowing the game down far too much.

Bale.. kept stopping and passing it backwards.

Crouch played almost the worse front man performance , terrible.

azza..i said last week he is going to get the chop if he doesn't start
performing soon...now is the time i'm afraid, i'm a big fan, but he is out of sorts right now,big time.

to be honest, the players i feared would fuck up, didn't...

Carlo.. did all he could really, made 2 excellent saves.

Charlie...the goal apart, played well.

Hutton..after a dodgy start..did ok




Look, i don't think we were really poor, but we started slowly again, it was their cup final, they got off to a flyer, and we were off the early pace.

i'm a bit worried that we started so slowly, surely we knew west ham would come out like they did.

I felt we had good possesion for parts of the game,but were far too slow, and never really opened them up.

another day to forget and move on...only the scum result sort of cheered me up a little....but not alot.

Agree with everything you said apart from the charlie bit!!! Charlie was at fault for the goal and in a sport of fine margins it was enough to cost us a point! Carlo was awesome but we lost 1-0!!

We always hear people saying that you learn more from a loss, but what did we learn today? From what i could see we simply wasnt up for it! Lacklust and almost this ongoing sense of arrogance where we expect poeple to roll over for us!!! Games like west ham away are about scrapping for every inch and arrogant a holes like tommy h give me the hump!!

 

[kkemal]

Cudicini 7 - Better than he has previously been given credit for. Saved us from ignominy.

Hutton 7 - Worked hard and showed that, contrary to opinion of many, he can defend as well as providing a fast attacking option.

Corluka 6 - Did a decent job but is very exposed by his lack of pace.

Bassong 6 - Short of his earlier quality and missed an experienced CB next to him.

Bale 6 - Demonstrated why BAE is first choice LB. Attacking value limited by playing in this position.

Lennon 3 - Lazy, gutless and totally ineffective. The guy is starting to look as though he is no longer interested.

Jenas 5 - Largely anonymous and lacks the constant commitment that this position requires.

Hudd 4 - Ineffective against any opposition that presses and plays at pace. Never at the races.

Modric 6 - Never often able to be a major threat as forced to play deep to help out the rest of our woeful midfield.

VDV 6 - Great player but would be more effective if he was a little less selfish. I'm sure this will resolve itself in time.

Crouch 3 - The novelty value has worn off and he is no longer any threat in the EPL as he has been completely "sussed". Opposing teams just mark him closely and he either gives away a free kick or fluffs his lay off. He simply does not have the positional sense or technical ability to be a major threat.

GDS - Not strong enough.

Pav - Did not make an impact. However I still rate him as the best of our currently available strikers and feel that with a decent run of starts (which he has never been given) his confidence would improve and he could deliver the goods. This of course will never happen.

Summary - Crouch cannot operate as a lone striker. All credit to the Spammers for a spirited performance and a fine display by Green but, notwithstanding, a hopeless midfield and an ineffective forward cost us a match which we should have won. Very, very disappointing.

PAV has ZERO pace, he cant hold the ball up, he is lazy, he lacks self confidence and he aint ugly enough!!!

 

[kkemal]

Generally it's up to the goalie if anyone goes on the post, and whom. So said Di Matteo on Goals on Sunday this morning anyway.

The manager and coaching staff should be setting this up before the games!! if our keepers are taking control of set pieces then something is seriously wrong!

 

[kkemal]

Very sensible - but we are not allowed to question Harry's decisions here because he "brought us the 4th place last season", are we?

With the team Harry put out v Arsenal, it would not have mattered much if Bassong was at LB rather than at CB, with Huddlestone at CB for that game (where he would not have had to run as much as in midfield and could have been taken off in 2nd half if required) and Hutton at RB. That would have saved BAE for the league game, given Bassong and Hutton more playing time and perhaps kept Huddlestone a bit sharper than he looked after the week's rest.

Spot on fella, SPOT ON!!!! people on here like BBLG wont have a word said about Harry!! I have been saying since last season that Harry is out of his depth at spurs!!! Motivating people is one thing, tactically winning a game in the dressing room is a whole other equation!!

Yes we finnished 4th!!! But had we beat wolves, stoke and hull at the lane last year we would have been 3rd!!! We lost those games cause we had no plan B, vs wigan 2 weeks ago we had no plan B!!!

In my opinion we have taken a step back from last season, take bale out of our team and defoe and we have no pace, lennon is playing his way into the reserves!!!

 

[BringBack_leGin]

Spot on fella, SPOT ON!!!! people on here like BBLG wont have a word said about Harry!! I have been saying since last season that Harry is out of his depth at spurs!!! Motivating people is one thing, tactically winning a game in the dressing room is a whole other equation!!

Yes we finnished 4th!!! But had we beat wolves, stoke and hull at the lane last year we would have been 3rd!!! We lost those games cause we had no plan B, vs wigan 2 weeks ago we had no plan B!!!

In my opinion we have taken a step back from last season, take bale out of our team and defoe and we have no pace, lennon is playing his way into the reserves!!!

To quote a

Spoiler

:

yawnnnn!!!!!!

Can't think who I'm quoting there though, you might remember?:shrug:.

As for never saying a bad word about Harry, I have said many, I just so happen to only do so when I think reasonable. I'll happily criticise him for playing Bale at left back v Utd when he's liable to be pegged back all day by an attacking right winger. I'll definitely criticise him for his tendancy to keep a player in the side far too long when their form is completely off. And I don't have much time for the odd stupid comment that he does make. However, to call him out of his depth with us, when he has done better already than any other manager we've had since Venables, is just plain banal.

If he is so poor tactically, how did he see us completely outplay Chelsea last season, the team who were head and shoulders better than every other side in the league last season? How did we go 2-0 up before our goalkeeper had a single meaningful save (around the 80th minute) to make against Arsenal at home last season. How did we dominate a team, managed by a triple Italian league winning coach, who had the most expensive side in the league, home and away last season, and then again at home on the first day of this season? How, in our first ever away group game in the Champions League, did we put on an absolute masterclass against a really good side and look like running away with it until our left back had an absolute moment of madness?

Yes, there are examples of Harry getting it wrong tactically. There are also examples of Wenger, in some peoples opinion the best manager in the league, getting it wrong. Not sure if you noticed WBA going 3-0 up at the Emirates yesterday. Is he tactically not up to it? Is he out of his depth at Arsenal? There are more than enough examples, good examples in fact, of Harry Redknapp getting his selection and tactics spot on to suggest that a) He is very much in his element, and b) he is good enough tactically. You argue that had we won certain games last season we'd have been 3rd. How about other sides above us? Chelsea and Arsenal both lost to Wigan. Utd lost to Burnley. These are sides with managers who have done it all, and better players too, players who have played together far longer than ours have.

As for the lack of a plan B, we have not had much opportunity to really judge that because, thankfully, the team Harry has chosen has more often than not seen us take the lead in games. We have turned it around when going behind on a couple of the rare occasions that this has happened though. West Ham away last season, and Wolves home this season, are the examples I remember best. Beyond that, we managed to finish 4th last season despite missing Lennon for half the season, despite missing Modric for half the season, despite only having Bales form for the second half of the season, despite having to play several centre back combinations and several central midfield combinations because of our trouble with injuries, and despite Defoe missing a fair few games as well. That is not the hallmark of side who are run by a man with no plan B. We continued winning, and winning, and winning, with key players out of the side.

Given that you are having your anti Redknapp issues addressed in this post, I think it only reasonable that I address the anti Levy issues you PM'd me.

From my work and the industry i work in I know a fair bit about our chairman! I know a hell of a lot of how poeple in his line of work are Remunerated. DL is there to oversea that the club makes a profit and it is successful.

My personal opinion is that DL needs to give redknapp the opportunity to sign players that will push us on to that next level.

Kyle naughton is a classic example of levy buying a player so that we can make a financial gain on him when we eventually look to sell him! Teams like man utd and Chelsea do not take into consideration how much money they will make from a player by way of future sell on fee.

I'm 31 years old and ive been going to spurs since i was 6 years old, all i've ever wanted is for us to break into that top 4 becuase we all thought that would mean world class players and big names coming to the lane!!.....But that never happened! It was our sole opportunity to take that next step but all people keep talking about is money!!! WHY???? we are a Football club not an investment bank!! I dont mean we should go nuts and buy everyone but surely at least ONE!!!! That is why i cant stand DL, and what he did to MJ was simply disgusting! We sold Berba for 30 million? did DL replace him???? no he never......we banked the profit and bought PAV!!!

why dont you tell me why you love DL so much?

First of all, you say that DL will be remunerated if we make a profit and you basis this on your purported extensive knowledge of the industry, I'll look past my doubts about your knowledge and address this as if I buy it by merely asking if you realise that the better the club performs on the pitch, the more money the club will make through prize money, through merchandising and through sponsorships (such as the two huge sponsorships DL arranged for our club this summer gone)? Therefore, given that his pay packet, according to you, is so heavily influenced by the profits THFCPLC makes, surely it stands to reason that he'd do his best to earn as much as he can from himself by bringing the club as much success as possible.

Oh, and as Chairman of both Spurs, and of ENIC, the majority shareholder of Spurs, there's a pretty good chance that Levy decides how much he gets paid without too much opposition.

As for DL not giving Redknapp (the manager you so dearly love) the opportunity to sign players to take us to the next level, have you not noticed the expenditure on players since Harry took over? Palacios, 12m, Keane, 12m, Defoe, 14m, Crouch, 9m, Kranjcar, 2.5m, Naughton, 5m, Walker, 3m, Sandro, 6m, Van der Vaart, 8m. 71.5m over 4 transfer windows, with the only player sales I can remember that would have added to the coffers being Bent and Zokora. Then there are the new contracts that have been awarded to Huddlestone, Dawson, Modric, Bale, Lennon, King and Jenas in that time, all players who would have earnt a pretty penny beforehand anyway.

Redknapp has had more than enough money to play with, and he has already had a very good squad to work with beforehand. Not many managers go into a side who has never played in the Champions League and inherit this potential line up: Gomes, Corluka, Woodgate, King, Ekotto, Lennon, Huddlestone, Modric, Bale, Bent, Pavlyuchenko. Hell, even without the additions since, I'd fancy that team (if all fit) to, over a season, challenge high up the league, even if the dodgy strike combo meant ultimate failure.

The comparison to Utd makes me laugh. Man U have the largest stadium in the country, earning something like 3m just from the gate receipts per game, and have bonus money from reaching the latter stages of the Champions League constantly over the past two decades. Even then, they are in horrendous debt which is well known to be endangering their future. As for Chelsea, they have a loan from a billionaire owner which does not need to be repayed, and even then, since the initial stage when was the last time they payed 20m or above for a player?

Kyle Naughton was one of two young defenders we bought as a package. He isn't looking too hot, the other looks very promising. You don't think Utd and Chelsea bring in young players who they know that they'll probably make money on even if they aren't huge successes at the club? Daniel Sturridge went to Chelsea on a free, will probably never be a first team, but will definitely fetch a few million if he leaves. Utd have brought in Tosic for a fair penny, and moved him on at a loss because he didn't make it at all, while Bebe looks like going the same way. Both were young players who were never going to impact the first team any time soon. They did similar with Nani and only now, a few seasons later, is he established as a first teamer.

As for your gripe that we have not even bought one world class player despite making the Champions League (whatever world class actually means), I guess that depends on how highly you rate Van Der Vaart. I rate him extremely highly personally, and I'm sure most Spurs fans do.

As for what he did to MJ, the way it came out (halftime during that Getafe match, still the most surreal experience I've had at a match) that he'd been dismissed was awful, but is that down to DL or some idiot in the press department who cocked up the timing of the release? I don't see how he was otherwise treated badly. He'd had many good players provided for him, at a high cost, during his time with us. I don't care if you think Jol, Comolli, Levy or the tea lady bought the players, the fact of the matter is that it is incredibly naive to think that the purchase of any one player was ever done without Jol's approval. In Jols 19 games at Spurs, before being sacked, he could have happily fielder this team made up of players bought only while he'd been our manager: Cerny, free, Chimbonda, 6m, Dawson, 4m, Kaboul, 6m, Ekotto, 2.5m, Jenas, 8m, Zokora, 8m, Malbranque, 2.5m, Bale, 10m, Bent, 16m, Berbatov, 11m. That's not accounting for some of the (ranging from good to excellent) cheaper players signed under Jol like Lennon, Tainio, Mido, Huddlestone and YP.Lee. Jol was ultimately no longer doing it and we were in danger of going down, and Levy had already put his neck on the line with the rest of the board by sticking by Jol after an equally poor start when everyone was then calling for MJ's head. I loved the big guy, but looking at it dispassionately, he ran out of lives.

As for selling Berba and replacing him with Pav, ill thought out though that might seem, can you tell me which striker worth the money we got for Berbatov would have come to us without us being in the Champions League, unless we threw City style money at them? Unless you want us to through over 100k a week at a player when we're merely in the UEFA Cup, it just isn't going to happen.

We did reinvest in a player who had forged a pretty good career of goalscoring goals and had just heavily impressed over the course of an international tournament qualifying campaign, and then the tournament itself. It turned out to be a poor signing, but at the time the guy looked like he had the credentials we need, and we were never going to be able to get someone of the ilk of Berbatov unless we got as lucky as we did with the big sulk himself. We signed Berbatov as a guy who most people knew as a good goalscorer from the Bundesliga, nobody predicted he'd turn out to be one of Europes best players, at least nobody on this site, and I doubt that's something I'd miss as, if you can't tell by most post tally, I'm on this site quite a fucking lot. I don't think we banked any profit though. Berbatov and Keane combined brought in 50m roughly. That summer we bought Bentley, Modric, Pav, Gomes, Giovani and Corluka for around 67m, with Hutton and Woodgate having come in the previous January for another 16m, and Palacios, Keane, and Defoe to come next January for another 38m. Levy pocketed nothing, he threw a hell of a lot of money, far more than he'd have wanted I imagine, at trying to take us to the next level.

Lastly, why do I love Levy? I don't really love him, it's difficult to love a chairman. I do, however, think he is amongst the best, if not the best, chairmen in the league. I do believe that in his ten seasons (something I am writing a book about believe it or not) as our chairman, he has taken us from being a mediocre, mid table side to a side who can genuinely compete with the established heirachy. I do believe that he has learnt from the mistakes he has made (and there have been some). I feel that he has managed this without putting our financial stability at risk at any point. I believe that he has repaired our clubs very poor, Sugar inflicted, relations with the media and with the local borough, hence how close we are to finally getting approval for our new stadium. I believe, on top of all this, that he has always acted as somebody who genuinely loves the club and understands every single fan, because he is one himself, and that on occasion he might have made mistakes as a result of this (fancy new manager in Ramos, persisting with the legend Hoddle when it became obvious that he'd lost the dressing room, being a bit too quick to try and sign shiny expensive players despite a previously good policy of getting quality cheaply (Robainson, Huddlestone, Lennon) ).

This is all why I have a lot of time for Levy, because I believe that not only has he been very good for our club, and will continue to be, in terms of making progress, but because, at heart, beneath the Cambridge 1st in Economics and the fabulously wealthy uncle, he is one of us. Has he made mistakes? Of course. Are the outweighted by his successes? Definitely. We take the occasional step back (11th and 8th after 2 successive 5ths) but we bounce back and surpass even the previous (4th last season). Even if this season ends up not reaching expectations, I will go into next season fully expecting to bounce back, because I know that our chairman, who has so far given me reason to believe in him, will put in every effort to make it happen.

Oh, and the bird hidden by the spoiler above, it's a great tit!

 

[yiddy_yiddingham]

Cudicini 8
Hutton 5
Corluka 5
Bassong 4
Bale 5
Lennon 3
Huddlestone 3
Jenas 4
Modric 6
Raf-VDV 7
Crouch 3
Keane 2
Do Santos 2
Pav 2