The let's not fire our manager thread

[ItsBoris]

How about instead of just keep him, we back him properly in the transfer market (not just give him some of the money generated from selling our best players). We need quality in every position, and then give him time to build his team with it, and if he can't do it within a generous period of time then find someone who can.

 

[Blake Griffin]

spoilsport

 

[jambreck]

That's just not a fair assumption to make at any level, any time. They also didn't have Falcao, Moutinho etc in a league far below their level.

Walter Smith went 2 games short of doing a quadruple with Rangers, O'Neil almost the same with Celtic, with significantly lower standard of players to Porto.

WTF?

What have Walter Smith and Martin O'Neill got to do with what I wrote?

I get the impression that you didn't even begin to read my post properly. I didn't make any kind of assumption. Where do you get that idea?

I merely pointed out that AVB has achievements on his CV already and still has plenty of time on his hands.

FFS!

 

[gorky]

If anyone wants AVB out already, they can suck my ding dong and serve me a milkshake.

 

[jambreck]

If he loses his next two, which we know are tough games, then our chances of top 4 are a distant memory, so his position becomes exposed, which going by the general behaviour in the football world will see the probable departure of AVB.

Chances of top four a distant memory?

After 13 games of a 38 game season?

Ridiculous!

 

[spud]

Chances of top four a distant memory?

After 13 games of a 38 game season?

Ridiculous!

Beat me to it.

Assuming that we do lose the next two games, we would be at worst six points out of the top four with a possible seventy-five to play for. It would be a bit more difficult to achieve, certainly, but hardly in the realm of impossible. Even if we do, the chance of AVB being fired as a result is just about zero. Those who want him out are going to be disappointed.

 

[parklane1]

Chances of top four a distant memory?

After 13 games of a 38 game season?

Ridiculous!

Spot on.

 

[The Spurs Lad]

WTF?

What have Walter Smith and Martin O'Neill got to do with what I wrote?

I get the impression that you didn't even begin to read my post properly. I didn't make any kind of assumption. Where do you get that idea?

I merely pointed out that AVB has achievements on his CV already and still has plenty of time on his hands.

FFS!

You tried to positively compare to him Wenger and Ferguson, I simply showed you were only using half truths and gave a wider comparison.

Yes Wenger and Fergie didn't achieve as much as he did at that age, however that means absolutely nothing. Just as Smith and O'Neil doing as well, if not better means absolutely nothing because the teams were completely different, at different era's in different leagues.

Basically what you meant to say was that he did better at a younger age than most, however that also means nothing because he also never had a playing career and got handed an early start in football coaching based on him living in the same apartment block as Robson.

 

[jambreck]

You tried to positively compare to him Wenger and Ferguson, I simply showed you were only using half truths and gave a wider comparison.

Okay..........I see now where you're going wrong. Let me remind you what Francis Gibbs originally wrote:

Seen absolutely nothing to suggest he (AVB) is as capable as Wenger or Ferguson, if you think you have you need to lay off the pipe

To which I replied:

He probably isn't.

But neither Fergie nor Wenger had won a treble of league title, domestic cup and Europa League / UEFA Cup by the age of 33.

He's still three years younger than either of those managerial greats were when they won their first trophies as managers. No telling what he might achieve over the next ten years or more.

Notice the first part of my reply - "He probably isn't". That is critical to the whole post. It is the position as I see it in the present. Everything that followed was either a statement of fact about the past (not half truth) or a simple acknowledgement of the obvious fact that none of us can see into the future.

As to me using half truths......utter bollocks. If I had been insisting that AVB is as good as or better than Fergie and Wenger, then you might have a point. But I was clearly doing no such thing. There was no need to go into chapter and verse as to those other two managers' early careers or the detailed circumstances of AVB's early success because the point wasn't to dismiss the qualities and achievements of the other two or to make any great claims as to the certainty of AVB's future greatness. It was simply to point out, since it was actually AVB's qualities that were being questioned, that he had past form and time on his side.

Yes Wenger and Fergie didn't achieve as much as he did at that age, however that means absolutely nothing. Just as Smith and O'Neil doing as well, if not better means absolutely nothing because the teams were completely different, at different era's in different leagues.

You might as well say that no manager can ever be compared to another, then, since no manager will ever manage the same players, at the same time, in the same league and against the same teams.

Basically what you meant to say was that he did better at a younger age than most, however that also means nothing because he also never had a playing career and got handed an early start in football coaching based on him living in the same apartment block as Robson.

Why on earth does it matter how AVB started his career? Bizarre comment. And, for what it's worth, AVB's first managerial / head coach job was at the age of 31. Fergie's was at the age of 32. And Wenger's at 34. So, very little in it. And the point still remains that AVB has time on his side to prove one way or the other whether he has it in him to be a great and successful manager. I really don't see what's so hard to understand about that.

Oh, and by the way, please don't try to tell me what I meant to say. You're not in the best position to judge such a thing.

 

[FinnYid]

I said something similar when Hoddle, Jol and Harry was sacked. Yet the club continued to improve during that period.

Even after Harry? Once we win something or are finishing on top 4 more often than not, then I might agree. However looks more like we're heading down from the 5th rather than moving up.

 

[Stavrogin]

Even after Harry? Once we win something or are finishing on top 4 more often than not, then I might agree. However looks more like we're heading down from the 5th rather than moving up.

We might slip a couple of places temporarily but the squad is stronger and the infrastructure is constantly improving. I'm pretty sure that if AVB doesn't work out, the next manager will have a positive effect, much like Redknapp; and we could well reach new heights.

As well as being sufficiently talented this is also a tough and physically strong group. It's probably better built for ferocious premiership campaigns than any squad we've seen.

 

[Lighty64]

it would be good to actually see a manager get given a 5yr spell to see if "That 5yr plan" would work.

a lot of the problem and dislike comes from the style of football we are playing at present. we have a brand new squad, that hasn't settled or all been given a chance. AvB has made mistakes, and so have all the most successful managers, so for once we need something called patience.

 

[parklane1]

it would be good to actually see a manager get given a 5yr spell to see if "That 5yr plan" would work.

a lot of the problem and dislike comes from the style of football we are playing at present. we have a brand new squad, that hasn't settled or all been given a chance. AvB has made mistakes, and so have all the most successful managers, so for once we need something called patience.

We can live in hope that happens.

 

[Spurger King]

it would be good to actually see a manager get given a 5yr spell to see if "That 5yr plan" would work.

a lot of the problem and dislike comes from the style of football we are playing at present. we have a brand new squad, that hasn't settled or all been given a chance. AvB has made mistakes, and so have all the most successful managers, so for once we need something called patience.

And if it sets us back ten years?

 

[Jaffer99]

I really want him to succeed, but we are playing some of the most boring football I can remember, he sets his stall out to not concede first and foremost and then looks to get a lucky goal from anywhere(mainly from outside the box), we have some very good attack minded players who aren't allowed to attack. you watch alot of the teams above us, when they get into the box, they have a few midfielders in there as well, how many do we have...

 

[Lighty64]

And if it sets us back ten years?

it only took him a season to get our highest points total in a prem season.

i'm not expecting us to win the EPL this season, yes we all want top 4, and would be a lot happier if the football was a lot more exciting. Yes i'd love to see us playing exciting football thrashing teams, but were not we are facing ops that put 11 men behind the ball and making it hard. our only real decent performance at home so far was against Norwich, made easier by getting an earlish 1st goal.

I know its a totally different sport, but Rory McIlroy took the world by storm in Golf, changed his tools (Clubs) at the beginning of the year and has totally lost his touch.

we were doing well under Jol, sacked him went backwards, and then went forwards pretty quick again once Redknapp took over. AvB had a very good 1st season, and if he hadn't been so stubborn in his starting line ups for games we might of rested players we could of had CL footy this year and still had Bale.

Bale has been a massive loss, and really believe we would be above the scum now if we still had him, but with so many players to fit in, losing our only LB so early and AvB making errors, we are in 7th spot, but still only 5pts adrift

 

[Lighty64]

just a little extra to my post above.

A&C will even like this

how would you moaners ever survived seeing Spurs stick with Keith Burkenshaw, after we were relegated in 76/77

PATIENCE

 

[ohtottenham!]

how would you moaners ever survived seeing Spurs stick with Keith Burkenshaw, after we were relegated in 76/77

Brilliant!

 

[ohtottenham!]

If he loses his next two, which we know are tough games, then our chances of top 4 are a distant memory, so his position becomes exposed, which going by the general behaviour in the football world will see the probable departure of AVB.

Currently level on points with Utd and above City - even with defeats in both games, way too early to talk about saying goodbye to the top 4. Both those clubs have even more pressure on them to succeed than we do given one's history and the other's investment. It's a really unpredictable season so far, and from the looks of it, it'll continue to be like that. Equally likely to see AVB keep his job and the others lose theirs!

 

[Blake Griffin]

the expression "it's better to be lucky than good" was made for avb.