Younes Belhanda

[WiganSpur]

£8m would be a steal

 

[ItsBoris]

Most definitely. I think he really could when you think of pairing Belhanda with another passing midfielder with Sandro. Personally, I think Belhanda + Carroll + Sandro is very reminiscent of the midfield that AVB had with Guarin, Moutinho and Fernando. It's got that same blend of defense, attack and passing ability.

Which is obviously interesting because I essentially replaced Dembele. The problem you may run into with Dembele and Belhanda is that their passing vision/ability is not what I would consider consistent enough to be pinging balls around the pitch. Belhanda can play very nice through balls on occasion and he's sort of like a blend between Holtby/Dembele (Plays the pass well on the ground, tough on the ball, scoring ability).

It's interesting because I've never seen Belhanda play but reading about him he sounded a lot like Guarin, which is interesting because AVB needs a player like that if he wants to replicate his Porto style. It also makes the question of Dembele interesting, because I personally don't see where Dembele fits into that kind of team (like AVB had at Porto). And I rate Dembele massively, I think he's one of our best players but he doesn't really fill any of those roles. I can see why AVB was reportedly picky about the players he wanted to bring in last summer. I hope he is given the license to sign the players he wants this summer.

IF Belhanda is the right player I could see the information being credible because for the price and with the length he has on his contract you would think that Andre would be all over it.

 

[GetSpurredOn]

I'm pretty sold on Belhanda as the missing piece of our CM jigsaw. Seems a good price for a player already playing and performing at CL level, and at only 23 has his best years ahead.
CM options of
Sandro, Livermore/Hudd. (Luongo/Parrett longer term option)
Dembele, Belhanda. (Carroll longer term option)
Sigurdsson, Holtby. (Mason longer term option)

The right blend of grunt and guile. Plus goals in there, something we have been missing for a while.

 

[Yid121]

Do you know if he's similar to Guarin? Wondering if he would have the sort of role that Guarin had at Porto.

what role would that be if you don't mind me asking?

 

[ItsBoris]

what role would that be if you don't mind me asking?

The same one Ramires played at Chelsea while AVB was there, which was the most "attacking" of the central midfielders but also kind of "box to box". I think AVB likes pacy, skillful players for that position who are also right footed and can overload the right flank while an inverted winger cuts inside. Seems to be what he did at Porto and Chelsea. So for us you would imagine Bale on the right cutting inside, Walker overlapping, and Belhanda bombing forward into the space depending on the movements of Walker and Bale. Just guessing but I think you'd want a right footed player there so they could easily cut the ball back or cross it if they received it.

 

[Moose Malloy]

The same one Ramires played at Chelsea while AVB was there, which was the most "attacking" of the central midfielders but also kind of "box to box". I think AVB likes pacy, skillful players for that position who are also right footed and can overload the right flank while an inverted winger cuts inside. Seems to be what he did at Porto and Chelsea. So for us you would imagine Bale on the right cutting inside, Walker overlapping, and Belhanda bombing forward into the space depending on the movements of Walker and Bale. Just guessing but I think you'd want a right footed player there so they could easily cut the ball back or cross it if they received it.

If I may also ask a question: how do you think AVB would see the other members of the midfield operating? Is it as simple as a playmaker (Moutinho), a dm (Sandro) as well as the box-to-box attacker?

Also, do you know whether an AVB playmaker would sit very deep, just above the back-line, or is his typical position further forward?

Thanks very much!

 

[himel420]

Belhanda has more goals in him than dembele........he won league 1 young player of the year just a year ago !!

 

[Syn_13]

Belhanda has more goals in him than dembele........he won league 1 young player of the year just a year ago !!

And Giroud was top goalscorer. You can't always judge players by the awards they pick up.

He does look a good talent but from what I've seen he can be a little wasteful and benefits from getting a lot of time on the ball which he won't over here.

 

[matthew.absurdum]

And Giroud was top goalscorer. You can't always judge players by the awards they pick up.

He does look a good talent but from what I've seen he can be a little wasteful and benefits from getting a lot of time on the ball which he won't over here.

Actually I don't think Giroud is a bad player, just don't expect he is another RVP
Podolski is much worse than him

 

[Syn_13]

Actually I don't think Giroud is a bad player, just don't expect he is another RVP
Podolski is much worse than him

I agree, Podolski has been very poor. Very inconsistent in his performances and has failed to make an impact. Giroud has been fairly unlucky, his hold up play is good and links well with others. He's a good team player but lacks composure and snatches at his chances.

 

[himel420]

And Giroud was top goalscorer. You can't always judge players by the awards they pick up.

He does look a good talent but from what I've seen he can be a little wasteful and benefits from getting a lot of time on the ball which he won't over here.

and giroud scored 17 goals and 10 assists in his first season in epl........what's wrong with it?? :\

 

[ItsBoris]

If I may also ask a question: how do you think AVB would see the other members of the midfield operating? Is it as simple as a playmaker (Moutinho), a dm (Sandro) as well as the box-to-box attacker?

Also, do you know whether an AVB playmaker would sit very deep, just above the back-line, or is his typical position further forward?

Thanks very much!

I may be wrong - this is partly informed and partly speculative - but from what I've seen AVB wants every player in central midfield to have the energy to defend, that's probably why he wasn't crazy about VDV from the sound of it.

I think the DM is pretty simple - ideally a destroyer like Sandro who sits pretty deep near the central defenders (it almost turns into 3-4-3 in attack), with 2 more advanced central midfielders. The next most advanced would be the midfielder who kind of controls the game, Moutinho it was at Porto. Pretty similar to Modric except Moutinho is better defensively and has a much better shot on him, though Modric is probably more skillful. Definitely not a deep playmaker, but really I think where this player is positioned should depend on where the ball is, and he should be pretty much always making himself available to receive a pass.

I think the most interesting midfield position is the most advanced one though, occupied by Guarin and Ramires. Both hard working players, defensively solid, but Guarin in particular is good at almost everything. A lot of pace, skillful, good cross, excellent defensively, high workrate, has strength, has a great shot, very good at tackling and passing, I mean I can't think of anything that Guarin isn't like a 7/10 at minimum. I think it's this player really that makes the movement that opens up the other team. At Porto Guarin would base his movements off what Hulk did, which meant the defense could be stretched even if the winger cut inside.

This may be a wild theory but I think AVB might be trying to get Parker to do both the first role and the third role (kind of). I can't think of another explanation for why Parker ventures forward so much even often finding himself in the opponent's box. It doesn't seem like something he would do unless he's encouraged to. Dembele is playing the Moutinho role, moving toward the ball and making himself available, and it seems like Parker is trying to be the destroyer AND the box to box advanced player, I may be wrong though.

 

[Tspurs]

And Giroud was top goalscorer. You can't always judge players by the awards they pick up.

He does look a good talent but from what I've seen he can be a little wasteful and benefits from getting a lot of time on the ball which he won't over here.

....and based on what I quickly researched, it was Belhanda that made Giroud look good....

Let this do the talking...

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[GetSpurredOn]

I may be wrong - this is partly informed and partly speculative - but from what I've seen AVB wants every player in central midfield to have the energy to defend, that's probably why he wasn't crazy about VDV from the sound of it.

I think the DM is pretty simple - ideally a destroyer like Sandro who sits pretty deep near the central defenders (it almost turns into 3-4-3 in attack), with 2 more advanced central midfielders. The next most advanced would be the midfielder who kind of controls the game, Moutinho it was at Porto. Pretty similar to Modric except Moutinho is better defensively and has a much better shot on him, though Modric is probably more skillful. Definitely not a deep playmaker, but really I think where this player is positioned should depend on where the ball is, and he should be pretty much always making himself available to receive a pass.

I think the most interesting midfield position is the most advanced one though, occupied by Guarin and Ramires. Both hard working players, defensively solid, but Guarin in particular is good at almost everything. A lot of pace, skillful, good cross, excellent defensively, high workrate, has strength, has a great shot, very good at tackling and passing, I mean I can't think of anything that Guarin isn't like a 7/10 at minimum. I think it's this player really that makes the movement that opens up the other team. At Porto Guarin would base his movements off what Hulk did, which meant the defense could be stretched even if the winger cut inside.

This may be a wild theory but I think AVB might be trying to get Parker to do both the first role and the third role (kind of). I can't think of another explanation for why Parker ventures forward so much even often finding himself in the opponent's box. It doesn't seem like something he would do unless he's encouraged to. Dembele is playing the Moutinho role, moving toward the ball and making himself available, and it seems like Parker is trying to be the destroyer AND the box to box advanced player, I may be wrong though.

A big thing was made of this setup in the summer. Sandro, earmarked as the DM was identified as a player to sit in, and as the full back goes forward, the centre half on that side slides over and DM drops in to retain a solid line. It was noticeable against City, that Huddlestone took up that position, roaming around very deep, with Dembele and Holtby providing the energetic drive in front of him.
Going into next year, having Sandro back in that deeper role will give us some extra solidity, but he is also capable of providing the box to box dynamism if we rotate the roles. Parker is trying to show he can fulfil both roles, but it is not working.
Belhanda seems a good fit for us this summer. Good price, club is prepared to sell, so shouldn't make it difficult to agree a fee. He has skill a d technique, knows where the goal is from midfield, and above all, as has been said above what AVB demands, he has energy and enthusiasm, doesn't shirk his tackles.
Any two from Dembele, Belhanda and Holtby in front of Sandro. Quality and depth. Get Carroll on the mix too, and we gave sufficient options to field string sides across all competitions.
Only issue then is who backs up Sandro? Do we stick with Parker, or place faith in younger options like Hudd (less athletic but more cultured to play out from the back) or Livermore (younger, cheaper, more versatile, less expectant over minutes on the pitch).

 

[Syn_13]

and giroud scored 17 goals and 10 assists in his first season in epl........what's wrong with it?? :\

Nothing at all, he's done very well. My follow up post in reply to matthew.absurdum states that I think he's a good player. He's not been as good in this league as he was in Ligue 1 though, which is all I'm saying. I'm not accusing you particularly, but there are plenty who seem to think that if someone shines in a league overseas they'll automatically be an amazing acquisiton, which simply isn't true. Look at Bony in Holland, looks amazing. Could be another Benteke over here, could also be another Rasiak...

It's all about fitting in. I think Belhanda is quality, go back to last summer and I recommended having a punt on him. But he does have his flaws along with players like Giroud and it's those flaws that could stop them from doing well over here. Giroud's flaws have limited him from being as good as he was in Ligue 1 (Arsenal were expecting him to be contender for top scorer), but luckily for them he hasn't got too many flaws and is good enough to adapt his game to a more supporting role. Difficult though because they want an out and out goalscorer in his position, so the fans and maybe the club feel he needs to do more in terms of goalscoring, so I feel sorry for him in that respect.

Tspurs is right in how Belhanda helped him loads at Montpellier, but it's not just about that. Arsenal have players like Cazorla, Arteta, Rosicky and Wilshere who can do the work Belhanda did for Giroud, the difference for me is Giroud's opposition. In France the defenders are not the same quality as over here, they're more susceptible to being split open by great passes and lose their man by clever running off the ball. This is why, IMO, Giroud hasn't scored as much and comes deeper to get the ball since defenders over here don't give him half as much time.

As for Belhanda, who knows? I do think he's worth a punt, but only our coaches will know whether they'll be able to work with him. If he's got the mental attitude to step up his game and learn how to play in the EPL and our coaches have the ability to bring it out of him we could have one hell of a player on our hands.

 

[Barry Mead]

Nothing at all, he's done very well. My follow up post in reply to matthew.absurdum states that I think he's a good player. He's not been as good in this league as he was in Ligue 1 though, which is all I'm saying. I'm not accusing you particularly, but there are plenty who seem to think that if someone shines in a league overseas they'll automatically be an amazing acquisiton, which simply isn't true. Look at Bony in Holland, looks amazing. Could be another Benteke over here, could also be another Rasiak...

It's all about fitting in. I think Belhanda is quality, go back to last summer and I recommended having a punt on him. But he does have his flaws along with players like Giroud and it's those flaws that could stop them from doing well over here. Giroud's flaws have limited him from being as good as he was in Ligue 1 (Arsenal were expecting him to be contender for top scorer), but luckily for them he hasn't got too many flaws and is good enough to adapt his game to a more supporting role. Difficult though because they want an out and out goalscorer in his position, so the fans and maybe the club feel he needs to do more in terms of goalscoring, so I feel sorry for him in that respect.

Tspurs is right in how Belhanda helped him loads at Montpellier, but it's not just about that. Arsenal have players like Cazorla, Arteta, Rosicky and Wilshere who can do the work Belhanda did for Giroud, the difference for me is Giroud's opposition. In France the defenders are not the same quality as over here, they're more susceptible to being split open by great passes and lose their man by clever running off the ball. This is why, IMO, Giroud hasn't scored as much and comes deeper to get the ball since defenders over here don't give him half as much time.

As for Belhanda, who knows? I do think he's worth a punt, but only our coaches will know whether they'll be able to work with him. If he's got the mental attitude to step up his game and learn how to play in the EPL and our coaches have the ability to bring it out of him we could have one hell of a player on our hands.

I think some points about Giroud are right but one point you seem to have missed is that he may be a great player going forward but maybe one of those players who takes a while to adapt. I think in his early games he clearly struggled to adjust to less space and time and the intensity of the PL but as the season has worn on he has improved and adapted. We shouldn't forget either that he was a pretty late developer in France and maybe will be a player who adjusts and improves over time. I don't think he's a Van Persie in that RVP took a time to adjust to the PL too although he started off more as a winger, but just because a player doesn't set the PL alight in his first season doesn't mean he can't be an increasingly good player going forward anymore than a player having a cracking first season will necessarily see that kind of goal tally again

I hope he flunks badly going forward but I think the worst that can happen is they have added a decent striker to their options

 

[Moose Malloy]

I may be wrong - this is partly informed and partly speculative - but from what I've seen AVB wants every player in central midfield to have the energy to defend, that's probably why he wasn't crazy about VDV from the sound of it ...

Thanks very much - that makes things clearer to me and ties in with the little I know.

For mid-field, it will be interesting to know what AVB does with Dembele if he gets Moutinho (or such) in. With the playmaker and DM, he needs an all-round player like you say. I love what Dembele brings to the team, but key-passes and goals are currently in short supply. Ideally, these needed to be added to his game, and I think just this week Mousa spoke about adding goals to move his game up to the next level.

In the meantime, it could be that the club wants these qualities in mid-field ready for next season ... which could mean Belhanda.

 

[ItsBoris]

Thanks very much - that makes things clearer to me and ties in with the little I know.

For mid-field, it will be interesting to know what AVB does with Dembele if he gets Moutinho (or such) in. With the playmaker and DM, he needs an all-round player like you say. I love what Dembele brings to the team, but key-passes and goals are currently in short supply. Ideally, these needed to be added to his game, and I think just this week Mousa spoke about adding goals to move his game up to the next level.

In the meantime, it could be that the club wants these qualities in mid-field ready for next season ... which could mean Belhanda.

It's a tough question that because if you have a midfielder like Moutinho, ideally you want the third one to be right footed. When that position is called "box to box" think of someone like Yaya toure - strong, quick, great passer and crosser, skillful, and a good shooter, who also does a job defensively. Extremely hard to find top quality players like that I think. Dembele I think is a player pretty close to that, only problem is he's pretty left footed, so if you had a midfield that looked like this:

----------Sandro-----------
-Dembele-----Moutinho-

You would lose the advantage of having the 'box to box' player bomb forward and send passes into the center to the forwards. Dembele could probably do the same thing on the left though, then the team would have to be set up differently. He would also need to score and assist more than he currently does like you say. The other option would be to not get a creative midfielder and instead groom Dembele into that kind of role. I think even if we didn't have a perfect role for Dembele he's still a great player to have in the team due to his versatility.

 

[Strikeb4ck]

This one seems like a no brainer for me, don't know why there's not more talk of this. Several links to him in the papers too.

 

[Tspurs]

I say get him before someone else does....soon there won't be many of these quality CM left now that Eriksen is on his way to Dortmund and Moutinho to Monaco.